JUL 13

the statement about a vertical axis being 10x more efficient is deceptive. on an indivual basis vawt's are far less efficient than hawt's. it's the fact that you can put many more vawt's on a parcel of land is what leads to the efficiency.
it is also stated that the vawts are cheaper which isn't true if you have to buy 5 for every 1 hawt.

I think its an interesting concept. It would be interesting to see which type is more cost efficient. an equivalent system would require more VAWT's but it would also require less land to build on.

to continue on Chuck's comments: Just change the title to "Caltech Study says Vertical Axis Wind Turbines 10x More Land-Use Efficient than Horizontal"

It strikes me that this negates one of the advantages that HAWTs give wind power, namely that the land remains useful for agricultural purposes. The density of turbines shown in the picture would make any kind of capital intensive agriculture very difficult.

These things are really noisy.

Will I agree it is a misleading head line, that is the head line game.

KW per square meter of ground is not important when setting up on a farm or in the ocean. But in location where space is limited say on a roof. Then the dense packing of VAWT's could be useful.

But they still have to be cost effective, which was not considered in the study.

This is a 3-part diatribe, so please be patient.

1. What if these VAWT's can be designed / built / arranged / spaced to create faster winds through the wind farm, to create some sort of synergy that could translate into even greater power output? And can they be close enough to be geared together to create some sort of gigantic flywheel effect?

2. I read a bit further into VAWT's (through links in this and other articles) and an idea that pops up is to retrofit these onto existing vertical poles, like light poles. And they can be found on every block of every city! Light poles in any city on any coast will never stop turning. Must be good for something besides lip service...

3. Since the most important thing you can change is your point of view, what if we change our way of thinking about making and storing our own power? In the past (and still today), central utilities produce the power so we can use it on demand (kind of like on-demand storage, if you think of it that way). Now we want to create our own power and save on our central utility bills but infrastructure costs (batteries, inverters, etc.) are a heavy burden, and they're already installed by the utilities. Maybe we can compromise and produce our own power to put into the grid, using it as storage? Actually, it's more like passing it to those who need it more at any particuler time, like when we're at work yet the sun still shines and the wind still blows. Kind of like an internet for power. Just as the power/creation of the internet was decentralization of information, why can't power be decentralized but still use the existing infrastructure for delivery and storage, a kind of symbiotic relationship, if you will? Sometimes, hybrid systems are better than the parts that created them...

In Canada we are getting complaints about the noise, are vertical turbines quieter. This would reduce one NIMBY complaint.

Horizontally placed bearings carrying VAWT load are likely to wear out far more quickly. Result: reduction in power generation efficiency, noise, and extra maintenance cost for replacement.

A main advantage of wind energy over solar energy is
the time frame.
When the sun goesdown so goes the source of energy.
Wind can provide it's energy source 24 hours a day.

Wind power is intermittent
Solar power is intermittent
Tidal or river flow is pretty reliable, and predictable.Dams are abhorant, but turbines in the flow, without dams ar really good. They can have grills on the intakes to keep fish out.

A combination of Solar and VAWT on a house is also better than either alone. Wind is higher in the winter and Solar is better in the summer.

I am working on a way to make the vertical axis turbine more efficient than the horizontal. I have just registered my machine.

This is by using a housing that traps the moving air rather than letting it pass after giving just a little of its energy.

Magnets out of microwave ovens are perfect fo r making Vawt frictionless and load bearing also self balancing less drag makes little noise if we spin coils opposite direction to magnets output should double. doing prototype now for placing behind wind sailing yacht once completed set to auto pilot goes round in circles make it perpetual motion producing energy on the oceans My idea anyway This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it '> This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it for feedback and comments cheers

Reply to Conrad Timothy - ROPATEC Italian company has had such a system working since 2007 in the Alps. The center housing is designed as a wing that helps to start the rotation in low wind and acts as a brake to the wind when it reaches a maximum speed set by the design. (operational example was 25 m/s)