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"Jet Engine" Wind Turbines Could Quadruple Power Generation

When we wrote about FloDesign's weird-looking wind turbines a while back, we were pretty excited about the www.sinai.org.il new design. But we were a little confused by how the things worked.

Well, FloDesign seems to have taken my confusion to heart, because they've created a very nice video showing exactly how the turbines work. If you can get over the inspirational music, then you're in for a treat. They take the time to explain a bit about how the turbine actually works, and also show that it's much easier to ship, requires less infrastructure, can be placed closer to people, and can be more tightly spaced in a wind farm.

The new turbines extract three to four times more energy from the wind, and so can be much smaller. They don't upset the flow of the wind as much, and so can be placed closer together. And since there is no risk of catastrophic failure (see video below) they can be placed nearer to populations.

All of this adds up to pulling a heck of a lot more energy from the wind. The trick will be figuring out how to mass produce the buy cialis overnight parts from strong, lightweight materials inexpensively. And then, they need to figure a way to put all the pieces together without compromising the strength of the turbine.

The Massachusetts Technology Collaborative has just invested $500,000 in FloDesign to help them scale up. I'm not sure what they'll be doing with the money (don't worry, I'm after them for an interview), but I imagine that amount could help them a great deal with prototyping.

FloDesign is definitely a company that we'll have our eyes on. This could be a game changer for wind.

 

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Fascinating--If It works
written by dbx1, March 26, 2008
I have always wondered why aeronautical engineering was not more involved in the design of www.ncitech.co.uk windmills. It looks like it has a lot of potential--if the engineering works out. This would be a natural for carbon fiber construction.
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I don't think this page has turned up on
written by Leon45, March 27, 2008
A side from that - it looks pretty interesting. Though that video seems to spend more time telling us why the old design aren't very good rather than telling us the purchase levitra in canada new ones good points.
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...
written by alex, March 28, 2008
Hey thanks for the great blog, love this stuff. I don’t usually do much for Earth Day but with everyone going green these days I thought I try to do my part.

I am trying to find easy, simple things I can do to help stop global warming (I stress easy, I don’t plan on going out and viagra 100 buying a hybrid). I took the Earth Day Challenge that EarthLab.com is promoting ( http://www.earthlab.com/ ) and I am planning on lowering my score. They have some pretty good tips (they call them pledges).

I am looking for more easy fun stuff to do. If you know of any other sites worth my time let me know.
0
It is a true breakthru
written by bobNASA, March 28, 2008
I dowloaded the AIAA paper on their site. This thing IS a game changer. They have addressed all the reasons prior shrouded designs failed! I wish I thought of it!
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whats happens when thing get sucked in
written by bob, March 29, 2008
Whats the danger to wildlife? I can imagine something getting sucked in and breaking this thing. Nice idea though.





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Wildlife?
written by Tom, March 29, 2008
No more danger than previous wind turbines i guess..
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Psst. Con man.
written by tussock, March 29, 2008
Modern large scale wind turbines run at better than 90% of the ideal efficiency. That ideal is itself nearly 60% of the total wind energy by area traced.

Someone who's saying they can triple that is saying they're collecting better than 150% of the total wind energy, which must involve gaining energy by stopping it, then gaining some more by restarting it. Clever that.

Anyone who believes it needs to go over the laws of thermodynamics some more. A lot more. Until you get it. Either way, do not give this con man your money.
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Wildlife
written by Hank, March 29, 2008
Though, obviously, they haven't tested these things in the field yet, there's some signs that they will be less damaging to wildlife. Because of the speed of the tips of www.privateeryachts.com traditional prop turbines, it's difficult for birds to actually see them. These will appear to birds as static, so they will be easier to avoid. Birds and bats don't generally fly int what they can see. Though, of course, we'll have to wait and see. Cell towers are also static and definitely contribute somewhat to bird mortality.
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...
written by Tim, March 29, 2008
I don't understand the viagra injectable fluid dynamics or other science going on here but am curious that with the intersected area being so much less than a regular turbine it could recover so much useful energy.
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a bit misleading but perhaps not a con
written by Josh, March 29, 2008
@Tussock
I'm guessing the three to four times more energy estimation is being calculated not per turbine which as you say is physically impossible but by land area. They claim that they can put these turbines much closer together which implies that they can capture more energy per hectare. Does that make any sense?
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Works better at low speeds and high spee
written by Al Fin, March 29, 2008
Yep, 3-4 times the dose viagra energy by land area. I'm impressed by the much wider range of wind speeds that are usable by this design.

These blades spin up to much higher speeds--like a gas turbine or steam turbine. The "vortices" generated behind the blades are simply a way of increasing pressure differential on either side of the fan blades. This draws more air through the blades.

If you know anything about gas turbines, you'll understand at least part of the design advantage.
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Size
written by josh, March 29, 2008
I am very impressed if they can make these work. Texas is covered with wind farms, which makes you feel good. However, when you see the "oversize load" truck in front of you and it's only carrying the very tip of the prop. It really makes you think these windmills should be a little smaller.
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Earth Hour
written by Emily, March 30, 2008
Hey! I participated in earth hour last night,and i was wondering if you knew of cialis china any statistics that show the effect it had on CO2 emmissions. If you do, it would be great if you posted them!
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Removal of wind energy
written by Randall Sperksy, March 31, 2008
This might all be well and www.sinai.org.il good for the power generation company and the manufacturer of the wind generators, but we have to face the fact that generation of energy in this way is theft. The people downwind of the generator are being denied their wind rights. If wind generators become very commonplace then I expect to see legal action taken over wind theft.
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...
written by tussock, March 31, 2008
:sigh: The limits on wind power are proportional to the vertical area swept by the blade, a cross section of the moving air. We are already running above 90% of that limit.

Land area isn't particularly useful as a measurement of any kind, unless your towers are low enough to make it unavailable for other uses. Here in NZ we put farmland under them, as the ground-level air isn't efficient anyway.

Cross-sectional area * air density * velocity^3 * time.

That's the wind energy of viagra pfizer online an air stream moving through a vertical area. Generating energy with the blade takes energy from the air stream, and we're already very near the limits of how much can be taken. Laws of thermodynamics, people; vortexes don't create energy, they use it.
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...
written by Josh, March 31, 2008
@Tussock
I had a gut feeling you were right. Hank gets a bit carried away with some of these press releases and I just got caught up in the moment too.
The combination of smaller turbines and less land use would be useful in some (limited) situations but the promises here are obviously too good to be true if we're already seeing 90% utilisation with regular turbines.
Thanks
Josh
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Really, it IS possible.
written by Dave, March 31, 2008
This design actually pulls in a greater volume of air due to the clever use of pressures at different points within the system. The video clearly explains this principle. This means that the buy levitra now turbine can actually grab more energy than an equivalent bladed design with the same vertical area swept by the blade because it's pulling in more air into the same area.

However, the 3x improvement claim is still only correct if you compare the two systems in the right way.
Comparing it by land area appears valid to me but I would be surprised if you could space these things 1/3rd of levitra dose the distance apart. However, for the same sized wind farm, you can extract some amount of extra energy out of the wind. That means something to me.

Also, if this thing can run at a greater variety of wind speeds, they may be including the extra time it is possible to run the new turbine in the calculation.

If you add the increased energy extraction per unit of land area and the larger variety of wind speeds this turbine can run in I suspect you will get close the a 3x improvement in output from a single windfarm.

As far as litigation from people downwind from a wind farm is concerned, I doubt that they'll get anywhere. Firstly, they would have to prove that they are actually receiving less wind and that the amount of wind they are not receiving is actually causing them harm. Secondly, the damages will only be proportional to the damages the genuine cialis online lack of wind actually causes them, which will be almost negligible. We're not talking about a completely calm day when everywhere else is getting 20 knots. We're talking about these guys getting 19.9 knots when everywhere else is getting 20 knots.
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...
written by disdaniel, March 31, 2008
I think it is a clever looking design...but gosh it uses a lot of material for the amount of area swept...maybe this is better than other shroud designs, but does the extra energy from the air speed/versatility provide greater value than the extra material cost?
Time will tell.
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Safer at higher speeds
written by Woody, March 31, 2008
Even if this delivers exactly the same power at a given wind speed the other benefits would make it worth while to pursue. Being safelyusable at slower and higher speeds, and transportable on one truck vs many sounds like a design improvement worth making this something to look at.
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Trade-offs
written by William Wilgus, April 06, 2008
This is really just a trade-off: High-torque (long, slow blades) vs. high-horsepower (shorter, faster blades). The vortex generation bit is simply an attempt to couple more wind energy into the blades; but as the wind speed increases, the apparent wind angle will change---and that will change the efficiency of the FloDesign turbine. Finally, the larger diamater of cialis samples the after tube is just taking advantage of the Bernoulli principle to `suck' more air through the turbine. As far as safety is concerned, the higher rotational speeds of the FloDesign might actually present greater damage potential than the slower long blade.
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Claptrap until they furnish power compar
written by William Wilgus, April 06, 2008
It's the old trade-off of high torque (long, slow blades) vs. high horsepower (fast, short blades). Let's see actual power generated comparisons.
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Claptrap until they furnish power compar
written by William Wilgus, April 06, 2008
It's the old trade-off of high torque (long, slow blades) vs. high horsepower (fast, short blades). Let's see actual power generated comparisons.
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noise polution
written by Tom, May 19, 2008
I'm more interested in the noise pollution. I know in my computer a larger, slower spinning fan is quieter than a small turbine style fan. I could only imagine the noise from acre's of these things humming along...
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i have no enthusiasm for a machine which
written by dan, June 22, 2008
so far this is hot air. where is the http://wffisher.com/buy-cialis-in-europe prototype? where are any performance data? who has built one? where is it?
what is it?
so far - nothing.
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U Fools
written by Cleva Clogs, November 13, 2008
Whoever is blithering about we already have 90% efficiency from standard wind turbine, is completly missing the point of these. You need your head deflating.
They are saying they are 3-4 times more efficiant, because they can run at any wind speed, in any direction, and can be placed closer together, nearer residential areas. They cost less to build and levitra philippines maintain apperantly too.
Why are there so many apparent more intelligent people here that have taken one look at this video and already decided that these will not work, or are not more efficient.
Considering some institute has invested half a million into this suggests people that know what there talkin about think its a good idea.
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you really dont understand..
written by Cleva Clogs, November 13, 2008
tussock. Have you actually listened to the video and read the reports on this?
I quote your comment:
'Laws of thermodynamics, people; vortexes don't create energy, they use it'
They do not use the energy from the vortex it creates, this was explained so that it dissapates the energy so that they can be placed closer together. With the old 'fashioned' designes because they 'block' the on-comming wind, turbines have to be placed further away so they can use the power from the wind.
If you are so smart, please go away and design somthing better than this.
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law suits against taking my wind?
written by last comment, November 13, 2008
This makes me laugh out loud! Lets trade our planet for the potential law suits that might (lol) occur from 'wind stealing'. You are basically suggesting that we not use wind farms at all. Why are people so negative about this change in design?
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Amazing confusion
written by Physicsman, December 07, 2008
Torque is a static rotational quantity, whereas, Horsepower is a linear quantiy with a time component mixing the two can be done and is done regularly in the automotive world. My confusion comes when those massivly long blades are not used for their torque, because in the nacelle they turn a generator which is regulated to a very precise number of rotations. The Windflo is designed to use its higher revolutions to turn a generator as fast as possible, which if done correctly will be far more efficient.

The fluid dynamics are sound. I would love to see a prototype.

BTW more squirrels are killed crossing the express viagra delivery road everyday than all the birds in the world killed by wind turbines. So who's watching out for the squirrels?hmmmmmmm?

As for the downwind lawsuits...you probably didn't recieve your Christmas presents due to potential liability issues either.
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Various thoughts
written by Neil, January 17, 2009
During the past few days I've been reading some very thorough papers on wind energy. I've learned several things in the process.

Wind is kinetic energy and contains a theoretical amount of energy calculated by the swept area (square meters or feet) and wind speed.

"The kinetic energy of wind is related to its velocity. This relationship is represented mathematically by the following equation:
P = ½ × ρ × A × V 3 , (D.1)
where
P = wind power (W),
ρ = air density (typically 2.70 lb/m3 [1.225 kg/m3] at sea level and 59̊F [15̊C]),
A = cross-sectional area of the wind being measured (m2), and
V = mean velocity of buy cialis from china the wind within the measured cross section (m/s).
A careful examination of this power equation reveals the following important fundamental truths about wind energy. Both the air’s density and the cross-sectional area of the wind being intercepted have a direct relationship to wind power. The air’s density varies with temperature, elevation, and humidity, but, in all instances, the density remains relatively low. Thus, any changes to air density have a minimal effect on the wind’s inherent power. Doubling the crosssectional area of a wind front leads to a doubling of the intrinsic power. Most important to wind farmers is the fact that the wind’s power is proportional to the cube of its average velocity. Thus, a doubling of the average or mean wind speed results in an eightfold increase in its power.

Intercepting the greatest practical cross-sectional area of wind creates the viagra overnite opportunity for capturing the greatest amount of energy; therefore, the primary design focus is on the rotor, which is the part of the turbine that actually extracts the wind’s energy. No mechanical device, including the wind turbine, is 100% efficient. The practical efficiency of a wind turbine is usually represented as its power coefficient, Cp, defined as that fraction of the wind power that may be captured by the turbine and cialis online 50mgs converted to mechanical work (and, subsequently, electricity). The power coefficient of buying viagra in spain a wind turbine is almost entirely a function of the rotor’s efficiency. The power coefficient is represented by the following expression:
P = ½ × Cp × ρ × A × V 3, (D.3)
where
P = power output of drug viagra the turbine,
Cp = power coefficient of the rotor,
ρ = air density (typically 2.70 lb/m3 [1.225 kg/m3] at sea level and 59̊F [15̊C]),
A = rotor-swept area, and
V3 = cube of the incident wind speed.

The power coefficient of the rotor has a theoretical maximum value of 0.593, called the Betz limit or Lancaster-Betz limit. This value is based upon the physical reality that even the most aerodynamically efficient turbine blade disrupts the airflow of incident wind, even before the www.karlbarth.nl wind front reaches the rotating blade. In actuality, the air molecules within the cross-sectional area swept by the rotor slow down as they approach rotating turbine blades and thus lose kinetic energy proportional to the cube of that velocity loss. The power coefficient of the rotor can be thought of as a correction factor, introduced into the above power equation to reflect the reality that the rotor’s power-capturing efficiency is less than perfect. To calculate the power coefficient of the entire wind turbine, one simply has to introduce additional correction factors to represent the mechanical inefficiencies of the entire turbine drivetrain. However, for the purpose of this discussion, the power coefficient of the rotor is the source of greatest turbine inefficiency to the extent that drivetrain inefficiencies need not be discussed in detail.

http://windeis.anl.gov/documents/fpeis/maintext/Vol2/appendices/appendix_d/Vol2AppD_1.pdf

Wind turbines extract energy by slowing down the wind. For a wind turbine to be 100% efficient it would need to stop 100% of the wind - but then the rotor would have to be a solid disk and it would not turn and no kinetic energy would be converted. On the other extreme, if you had a wind turbine with just one rotor blade, most of the wind passing through the area swept
by the turbine blade would miss the click here levitra legal blade completely and so the kinetic energy would be kept by the wind.

Betz Limit:
Albert Betz was a German physicist who calculated that no wind turbine could convert more than 59.3% of the kinetic energy of the wind into mechanical energy turning a rotor. This is known as the Betz Limit, and is the theoretical maximum coefficient of power for any wind turbine.

Good wind turbines generally fall in the 35-45% range.

http://www.kidwind.org/PDFs/SUPPORT_Math_Coefficient of Power.pdf

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...
written by Brzdic, February 02, 2009
I am glad I found this site, I was just thinking about some new way to create power today and jet engine was exactly what I think can generate more power, as it does in jet engines. This gave me some hope as plane evolution, wind turbine evolution will go the same way. I am just disappointed that I was not the first one who thought about this. :)
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...
written by Will Thomson, March 06, 2009
Notice the swept area size of the standard prop(about 95m diameter) compared to the swept area of this thing - 10m2? ) Thats a shed load of wind area being missed. try to build one of these with a swept area of 95m in diameter. It would be enormous, and far too heavy to stick on a pole up in the air. It is bound to be more efficient at capturing the wind going through it, but has such a small swept area it will never compete with a standard prop design.
Notice in the video also how the prop desig is shown the wind being forced around it cos of the high pressure area building up in front. THIS IS CONVENIENTLY MISSED IN THE ANIMATION FOR THE FLOWDESIGN TURBINE. But it would still happen Just the same for both designs. Even with those fancy after-burner intake nozzles.
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owner
written by lloyd parks, April 27, 2009
Why not mount the combine cialis and levitra apparatus horizontally several meters above grade and "scoop" the wind into it? If the wind became too high, the scoop could be shuttered. If there was enough heighth to the installation, warm air rising into cooler air above could add to the wind speed. I have been around nuclear plant cooling towers and www.marthawashingtoninn.com three is a nice breeze blowing into them at all times
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Next Generation Wind Turbine...
written by Phillip, November 04, 2009
FloDesign is a great design but they didn't take it far enough in harnessing the wind true power like a jet engine.

Dragonfly will - three times over with not one generator but 3 build into the "Body Wing" unit! Designed to run in winds in excess of 200+ mph - no other wind turbine can make that claim! But you do the math its designed to replace what we know today wind turbines! We can't show you how far we've come since our last posting because you're looking at the tip of this iceberg! www.dragonfly-windturbine.com - You be the judge!
0
...
written by Fred, November 28, 2009
How do they get around the Betz limit?

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well defined system
written by davinder, February 28, 2010
I think the inventors have taken trouble to find out what is wrong with the present design and made an excellent attempt to correct it. I believe it reduces eddies created by the blade end tips and makes use of wind entrainment.
A great leap
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Tip Info / New Technology Submission - Gearturbine - Atypical
written by Carlos Barrera, April 17, 2010
smilies/wink.gif
gearturbine.260mb

YouTube Video; Atypical New * GEARTURBINE / Retrodynamic = DextroRPM VS LevoInFlow + Ying Yang Thrust Way Type - Non Waste Looses


GEARTURBINE -Atypical Combustion Turbine Engine, -State of the Art, -New Thermodynamic Technology, -With Retrodynamic "Dextrogiro vs Levogiro" Effect, is when the buy cheap generic cialis inflow direction moves is against [VS] of the circular rotary dynamic / RPM Rotor Move VS Inflow Conduits Way /ACTION VS REACTION / Front 2 Front / Velocity vs Velocity, making in a simple way a very strong concept of http://www.pjr.com/discount-drug-cialis power thrust, a unique technical cuality. -Cilindric shape dynamic mass (continue Inertia cinetic positive tendens motion / all the motor weight is goin with the power thrust direction), -Non Waste, parasitic losses form-function engine system for; cooling, lubrication & combustion; -Lubrication & Combustion inside a conduit radial position, out way direction, activated by centrifugal force Fueled Injected (centrpetal to in) , -Cooling in & out; In by Thermomix flow & Out by air Thermo transference, activated by the dynamic rotary move, -Increase the first compresion by going of reduction of one big circunference fan blades going to, -2two very long distance cautive compression inflow propulsion conduits (like a digestive system) (long interaction) in perfect equilibrium well balanced start were end like a snake bite his own tale, -Inside active rotor with 4 pairs of retrodynamic turbos (complete regeneration power system), -Mechanical direct "Planetary Gear" power thrust like a Ying Yang (very strong torque) (friendly loose friction) 2two small gears in polar position inside a bigger shell gear, wide out the rotor circunference were have much more lever power thrust, lower RPM in a simple way solution for turbines, to make posible for a some new work aplication (land). -3 Stages of inflow turbo compression before the combustion. -3 points united of power thrust; 1- Rocket Flames, 2-Planetary Gear & 3-Exhaust Propulson, all in one system. -Combustion 2two continue circular moving inside rocket Flames, like two dragons trying to bite the tail of the opposite other. -Hybrid flow system diferent kind of aerolasticity thermoplastic inflow propulsion types; single, action & reaction turbines applied in one same system, -Military benefits, No blade erosion by sand & very low heat target profile. -Power thrust by barr (tube); air sea land & generation aplication, -With the unique retrodynamic technical cuality of "dextrogiro vs levogiro" effect is when the inside flow moves against of the rotor moves making a very strong concept, RPM Rotor Move VS Inflow Conduits Way (an a example is like to move the head to the side of the strike ponch) -A pretender of very high % porcent efficient power plant engine. -Patent; Dic 1991 IMPI Mexico #197187
0
President
written by Gerald Brock, September 25, 2013
We have a live video feed of our turbine on our website, we are working with ABB power and automation who employs 128,000 people. Our machine starts making power at 5 MPH, and note this we are exceeding the Betz Limit relative to our swept area! FloDesign is infringing our patent.

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